Someone sent me a link to this, I remember reading a little about it once before, but I hadn't read the whole thing and some interesting stuff comes up from this:
1987 BBC Radio Interview; Highly Recommended.
B: There’s a bunch of questions there! But let’s stay on the topic.
K: So it’s a little bit like following a plot. So here you are, you’re doing this technique and you’re breaking through certain levels that you think are holding back at least Ron Hubbard and his organization on some level.
D: Well, holding back all of mankind. What Ron Hubbard discovered was why mankind is trapped and why mankind in the condition it is. He wanted to free us. He put the organization there because he wanted it to free everyone on the planet.
But, instead, it was heavily attacked and he was attacked, and it was finally taken down through children. And I believe those children themselves were part of a psychic program, because those children were given jobs in the organization to run the adults.
They were called “The Messenger Org”. They never went to real school. They were like five, six, seven years old. They were his servants and the only people who could get close to him.
B: Were they that young?
B: I didn’t know that.
D: Oh yeah, you bet they were, it’s all they knew.
K: Did they go on the boat? How many children, and did they go on the boat with him?
D: Yeah, they were the only ones who had access to Ron. The adults couldn’t even get to him, only the children could. And it’s the children who took over the organization. The person that runs that organization today was one of those children that started out very young.
K: Okay. And how many children? Do you know?
D: I don’t know how many there were. Hundreds. In the end they fought it out. I mean at the end there were three or four of them that were fighting it out for control of the Church and they were like 12 years old, or not much older. One of them won, and he got control of that Church.
B: Let me clarify this just a little bit by bouncing this off you - because it kind of sounds a bit weird. What you’re saying is that these children served as messengers.
D: They called them that.
B: Right, but let me tell you what I understand, because I was never in the Church, and I was never a part of that environment at all, so I’ve got no personal experience.
What I’d understood was that they served as messengers, both verbal messages and written messages, but the reason why they had power was because they had the power to change the message, or not deliver the message, or to falsify messages.
D: That’s right. And there must have been instruction to them that programmed them to know how to do alter directions until they themselves became instilled with the personal drive for power and dominance. They were intentionally programmed to have enormous egos.
B: And therefore that put them in entire control of the communications, like a spy program in a computer.
D: They were. Exactly.
B: And they could do absolutely anything they wanted to.
D: That’s right, and they did. They totally did. They totally did. Many communications never got to Ron. Many were altered. He ended up afraid or withdrawn, a Howard Hughes-type figure. No one else talked to him but the children.
K: So who recruited the children initially?
D: Well, I believe that the government infiltrated sleeper and conscious adult agents into the Church who trained the children; that there programs with secret intentions that went on with the children, but that it wasn’t known to the parents, and was hidden in plain sight.
K: Agents who were members of the organization, you’re saying.
D: Exactly. Exactly. But the children were programmed to become inhuman and not like children; they became an entity unto themselves.
K: They were trained, brought up in the organization, so to speak, and trained in these methods.
D: Well, not trained very well in actual Scientology, not the real techniques, but the powerful military side of things. Entire sections became like the Gestapo.
D: Not educated in real Scientology very well at all. They were taking down the real Scientology.
K: They were infiltrated in a sense that somehow, but did you feel that...? Like let’s say we have a kid, would you feel the child and the parent would be infiltrated by the CIA?
D: They were separated from their parents.
K: They were separated?
D: Because there was, it was called The Messenger Organization. It was within the Church. and the parents would be working in some section of the organization and the children would be going through their own training, which was supposed to be like regular school - but wasn’t so much like regular school. It was highly disciplinarian.
The person who took over the Church when Hubbard died wasn’t even a high school graduate. He did NOT have a good education. But he was trained in force and he was trained to dominate. He was trained in control. He was trained in using power, and he runs that organization that way.
B: What you’re saying is that the conditioning, so to speak, came much more from the organization than from the parents, and it’s almost like...
D: I think there was an organization within the organization, because the IRS ended up running... I mean, the place was loaded with IRS agents and lawyers that ran it, which took over the Church.
K: And what year was this when that happened?
D: It happened fully in the ’80s. The final coup.
B: I remember that another whistleblower, Bill Robertson, who we may or may not end up talking about, named Alan Hibbert as also one of the infiltrators - and also, I believe, the Broekers. All of this is in the public record and it’s extensively debated on the internet. But the point is that there was good reason to believe that there were agents in place....
D: Oh, there has to have been.
B: ...in this pyramidal structure that was complicit in this takeover and many of them were sleepers, so to speak, that had been there for a very long time. And all this was going on alongside you because you were also fairly senior. I think this was the question Kerry was asking. You were fairly senior in this pyramidal structure. Is that accurate?
D: No, I was close to people that were senior in the structure.
B: Okay. All right.
D: See, it’s my belief that the FBI, the CIA and the IRS, the AMA and the American Psychiatric Association, all together joined in taking down Scientology because it was exposing each one of them because Hubbard was spying on them and releasing their own incriminating documents - and openly curing disease in the 50s.
He published a periodical of listed crimes with the time, location and events, with names. He made enemies, alright. But the biggest threat was that Hubbard was a threat to the Illuminati, to the Anunnaki, because he had much truth about our past, about who we actually are. The Anunnaki don’t want us to keep remembering our history! And he researched and published successful techniques to free us of our amnesia. He just didn’t know the Controllers are STILL here, and never left!
K: How did these people begin the take-down? In other words, how did it manifest?
D: It manifested through children. Those children in The Messenger Org were not the same as the people in the regular organization. They were not the same. They were separate.
K: But I’m saying you’ve got auditors, you’ve got the Scientology organization operating, so how did, literally, the takedown occur? Do you even know? I mean, I’m just asking.
Like in other words, was there... let’s say... I’m just going to guess: was there some human being besides a child who went into a position of power, who became sort of an insidious leader?
D: It has to have happened on an invisible adult level first. But the children manifested the takeover. There was corruption that happened where people were compromised, as was Ron. Ron didn’t know the real enemy.
And true to the age old technique, his own justice system ended up turned in on the members themselves. L. Ron Hubbard was compromised, and I don’t know which L. Ron Hubbard, but L. Ron Hubbard was compromised and made to be paranoid and it became an organization of dominating enforcement. His carefully thought out justice system, which he simply called Ethics, became a series of kangaroo courts.
People lost the real evolution of a workable human justice or ethics system and blamed the now travesty on the original for the crimes now committed using THAT as the means.
His real ethics system was a work of genius, but was subverted and used to commit horrible crimes against members. We blamed the system, and didn’t know it had been intentionally corrupted and turned suppressive to the members themselves in order to take them all down.
Hubbard became blinded with paranoia and it started bit by bit, way back. From fearless to frightened. If he only knew there was good reason to be frightened, but, as he said, if you know the real reason for something you can DO something about it. You can deal with it. The truth sets us free.
K: He ended up taking money? Or they started changing the techniques?
D: Money was taken off the front lines, but Hubbard allowed or participated early on in using forcefulness to control people and to try to discipline them. Desperate.
Major mind control technique. Entice a pure being to commit one act of compromise, and he is so basically good that that act becomes an Achilles Heel until he can see WHO manipulated him and why and what his own part in it was.
B: Let me make a suggestion here, which is also in the form of a question. Because, as I was saying, I wasn’t around at this time. What I understand is that, for example, a message would come through apparently from Hubbard with apparently his signature on it saying: Don’t do it that way, do it THIS way from now on. This is an order.
And nobody ever really knew whether this came from Hubbard. It could have been falsified because the messengers were fully in control of the communication.
1987 BBC Radio Interview; Highly Recommended.